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Can we get Otani without Darvish?

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  • Can we get Otani without Darvish?

    I have been thinking that keeping Darvish is the key to the entire franchise for the next 3 years. But if he really is set on 7/175 and we can get several premium prospects for him, I think you basically have to pull the trigger on the trade.

    But if you trade Darvish and don't resign him, can you still get Otani? We might have the highest amount to pay from teams in the AL where he could DH. Plus even if Darvish signs in NY or LA, he would still give Otani a glowing report about Texas.

  • #2
    Why would Ohtani want to go to a team that's years away from competing? Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Redcap View Post
      Why would Ohtani want to go to a team that's years away from competing? Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
      I tend to agree. Without Darvish or another top-of-the-rotation starter in place alongside Hamels, it will be very difficult IMO to convince Otani that this team is equipped to contend for a World Series championship. And since money's going to be relatively equal for all interested teams, I would imagine competitiveness will be the deciding factor here.

      The one thing the Rangers do have, as Kaiser hinted at, is the ability to DH him every day, which might be a selling point. But doing so would require us to play Choo in the field, which makes the team worse, or trade him, which will be very difficult.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Redcap View Post
        Why would Ohtani want to go to a team that's years away from competing? Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
        because he is not like you

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        • #5
          Originally posted by dannyboy8517 View Post

          I tend to agree. Without Darvish or another top-of-the-rotation starter in place alongside Hamels, it will be very difficult IMO to convince Otani that this team is equipped to contend for a World Series championship. And since money's going to be relatively equal for all interested teams, I would imagine competitiveness will be the deciding factor here.

          The one thing the Rangers do have, as Kaiser hinted at, is the ability to DH him every day, which might be a selling point. But doing so would require us to play Choo in the field, which makes the team worse, or trade him, which will be very difficult.
          so he just gives up his idea on playing both ways? one thing about it is the rangers have been on him for multiple years and if they were afraid of his plans they wouldnt be chasing him. choo would be the last of the reasons that they wouldnt pursue him. They are about 70-80 million under right now. They can eat part of choos contract if necessary especially if it meant signing ohtani

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          • #6
            Originally posted by rainag View Post

            so he just gives up his idea on playing both ways? one thing about it is the rangers have been on him for multiple years and if they were afraid of his plans they wouldnt be chasing him. choo would be the last of the reasons that they wouldnt pursue him. They are about 70-80 million under right now. They can eat part of choos contract if necessary especially if it meant signing ohtani
            Did you even read my post? I said the opportunity to DH everyday would be a selling point. But that would create (or exacerbate) a Shin-Soo Choo problem. Choo's presence won't keep the Rangers from pursuing Otani. I'm not sure where you got that idea from. But penciling him in in right field everyday would weaken the team considerably, and I'd much rather trade him than go that route.

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            • #7
              It's unlikely. Darvish .0001% chance after we trade him. Otani maybe 2% chance? Likely the Yankees or a team viewed as closer to contention will sign him........this was always the likely scenario

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              • #8
                There's no reason to think that Texas will have any sort of significant advantage over other contending teams interested in Ohtani. They're going to have to hope the return on Darvish includes a future rotation mainstay and that their current farm system will eventually develop an upper tier starter.
                Last edited by RangersBamBam; 07-28-2017, 08:29 AM.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by rainag View Post

                  because he is not like you
                  You mean he doesn't want to go to a competitive team for about the same amount of money? Or is it you have some sort of fairy tale belief that the Rangers are going to magically get a bunch of prospects after a fire sale that will make them instant competitors.

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                  • #10
                    The Dude isn't even sure if Ohtani even has a say in where he goes. Is this new system work like the old system where the team with the most international spending money to post gets negotiating rights? Or does Ohtani just pick which ever team he wants to sign with. It's The Dude's understanding that he is not a free agent.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Redcap View Post

                      You mean he doesn't want to go to a competitive team for about the same amount of money? Or is it you have some sort of fairy tale belief that the Rangers are going to magically get a bunch of prospects after a fire sale that will make them instant competitors.
                      Yeah, it's going to take more than one year to catch up to the Astros, and it's debatable if this fire sale will accelerate the process. You hope that a couple of guys who you get turn into future productive players but they may not and just be throw ins for other trades.

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                      • #12
                        I have never accepted the premise that Shohei Otani was determined to play with Yu Darvish.
                        Signing Darvish to a contract extension with the expectation that Otani would follow would be folly.
                        Giving a 31 year old pitcher a 6-7 year contact in the $150-$170 M range is not a good business at any rate.
                        The Rangers have just as good a chance of landing Otani without Darvish.

                        Will the Texas Rangers be able to woo Otani to Arlington- ?-probably not ---but i think they may have as good a chance as anyone.
                        Do you realize how many Japanese fans have been wearing Texas Rangers jerseys and watching Darvish pitch for them.
                        They have been making vacation trips to Arlington.
                        I think Otani has a positive opinion of the Rangers. There is a mystic about the state of Texas.
                        Because of the rules Otani will be a huge bargain. The Dodgers and Yankees cannot money whip the young man.
                        And Texas has a billion dollar stadium in the works.

                        The Texas Rangers are poised to make a very serious run at this young man.
                        Shohie Otani will make a huge impact on the team that signs him--beyond wins and losses.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by RangerDude2016 View Post
                          The Dude isn't even sure if Ohtani even has a say in where he goes. Is this new system work like the old system where the team with the most international spending money to post gets negotiating rights? Or does Ohtani just pick which ever team he wants to sign with. It's The Dude's understanding that he is not a free agent.
                          I don't think it works that way. I think JD explained it that several clubs can win negotiating rights, and then it's up to the player to pick his team. Some clubs may not have international spending money to enter into negotiations, but we all know there are ways to create it.
                          Last edited by RangersBamBam; 07-28-2017, 08:45 AM.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by RangerDude2016 View Post
                            The Dude isn't even sure if Ohtani even has a say in where he goes. Is this new system work like the old system where the team with the most international spending money to post gets negotiating rights? Or does Ohtani just pick which ever team he wants to sign with. It's The Dude's understanding that he is not a free agent.
                            Unless the number has changed the price for the bid will be 20 million dollars, the max bid under the current system. Any team that meets that maximum bid has the ability to negotiate a contract with Otani for 30 days after its announced. He can choose any of those.offers. That's why the idea of keeping Darvish around makes it more likely to land Otani because you're adding in a soft reason for him to come here as opposed to somewhere else. So Otani is somewhere between a free agent and the exclusive negotiation of the previous posting system. If he doesn't sign with a MLB team within 30 days he goes back to his Japanese team for the year.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Redcap View Post

                              You mean he doesn't want to go to a competitive team for about the same amount of money? Or is it you have some sort of fairy tale belief that the Rangers are going to magically get a bunch of prospects after a fire sale that will make them instant competitors.
                              How are the Rangers not a competitive team? Because they will have an abnormal amount of slumps and injuries for the next three years, like they did this year?

                              The Rangers will still have the position players that are a mix of veterans like Betre and the young core of Mazara, Gallo, Andrus, etc.

                              They will still have Cole Hamels, a bunch of bullpen arms and a bunch of money to spend on a 2/3 starter.

                              The Rangers will be competitive even without Otani, the question is how much. They got struck by lightning this year and are still a .500 team, there is no reason to act like this is the Washington Senators.

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